This is really poor reporting. Why aren't there any comments from the DIA or anyone connected with the millage from the DIA? This is what drives me crazy about the Patch. None of the reporters ever ask hard questions. McMillin is a right-wing loon and he needs to have hard questions asked of him.

It seems to me that the Patch is reporting what happened at the meeting. Mr. Tietz, said they did not invite someone to speak from the DIA. What a great panel discussion. This is very typical for this group of politians. They invite only those on their side, those that agree with them attend and it gets in the news. Great free publicity without all the facts. Were they afraid people would get the whole story?

sorry for the is spell - politicians

This is frightening. I had no idea Doug Tietz was part of this idiotic group of ideologues. First Janice Daniels showed her true colors and now Doug Tietz. The Troy Republican Party is a real mess. Thank you Patch for revealing what this was: a one-side, very scary, political stunt to put another name and face in front of voters so a crazy group can help him further his political career. Beware of Doug Tietz's name on any ballot. Got it.

The DIA is spending millions campaigning for this thing. The ballot proposal is written to avoid telling taxpayers that their dollars are going to Detroit. We all know that Detroit and Wayne County gov'ts have a very poor track record when it comes to fiscal responsibility or transparency.

This venue was open to anyone who wanted to hear the opinion of four men who have looked at the issue. Anyone was allowed to ask a question. You may not agree with their arugment or their philisophical viewpoint, but they were honest about where they are coming from. There is NO money funding this viewpoint. Where do you think folks are supposed to go to hear this sort of information before they make a decision on this ballot proposal?

Yes, you are correct that folks are supposed to hear this sort of information before they make a decision on this ballot proposal, but I would of liked to hear both sides. If their information is correct, then there should be no problem inviting the opposite side to come speak and question them on the issues. I don't like when it's one side only and they are not invited or welcomed. It makes you wonder why????

Why didn't they invite the other side to discuss this issue? This panel strikes me as just an opportunity to publicize a very one sided perspective! If they are confident in their facts then they should welcome a dialogue to discuss this millage. Additionally the Patch author, while providing links to DIA's mileage info within the article, missed an opportunity to give the DIA a chance to respond to this panel's discussion. Giving both perspectives on an issue is what fair and balanced reporting should be about.

It's not an open and honest panel discussion if you don't discuss both sides of an issue and invite representatives with an opposing POV. This was more of a rally than a "panel discussion." A weak attempt to drum up support for their opinions.

It's also hard to believe anyone would think that the DIA is involved in some sort of huge conspiracy to waste tax money. Again, why such venom is spewed at an art museum and a Detroit treasure is truly incredible.

Google the panelists. Bob Gosselin owes the city of troy about $7,000 in taxes and has multiple arrests regarding solicitation of prostitutes. Doug Tietz ran an anti anti discrimination campaign in Oklahoma. Tom McMillin is supported by a hate group AFA and is author of HB 5039 which would eliminate anti bullying policies for gay kids. These guys are a 3 ring circus.

Without both sides being represented at this panel, I see absolutely no value in it. It's a shame because I would have loved to hear both perspectives as I am trying to determine how to vote. What a waste of Community Center space.

Rob P you got one thing wrong. Tietz ran the Michigan and Nebraska ironically-named "Civil Rights Initiatives" that were the scandalously pro-white male initiatives that would end all efforts to help give a leg up to everyone else in the two states. Remember the one in Michigan? He was behind it. And how racist is he behind the scenes? When David Wisz gave his bigoted anti-transit center rant before the city council in December and asked Tietz if he "wouldn't be invited to [Tietz's] Christmas parties anymore," Tietz told him not to worry, he would, so the two are fast friends. Want to know more about extremist Tietz, who claims he ran for city council as a family man and small business owner (ha!)? Read here- http://www.keeptroystrong.com/2012/05/just-how-extreme-is-doug-tietz.html

And I've got to say, if Bob Gosselin who doesn't pay taxes and hires cops posing as hookers thinks the DIA is anti-family, one just has to wonder what his definition of family is... ???

I recently went to a Clark Durant town hall and was able to ask Mr. Durant a question about his views. He didn't invite Pete Hoekstra or Debbie Stabenow. I did not consider this unfair at all, but a chance for me to gain information about a candidate.

If one side wants to have a discussion about their views, I see no reason they need to invite the other side. If you want the flip side, it's out there. You don't need it served up on a platter.

If Roger Waters knew Mr. Gosselin used "another brick in the wall" in this context, he would never stop throwing up.

As one who DID attend the meeting, I find the Alinsky style responses posted here to be somewhat disturbing. Instead of focusing on the issues, the writers are attacking the panelists. No one has disputed the validity of the figures, because they're indisputable - they were provided BY the DIA. So all of the questions about excessive salaries, the mis-management of city resources, the possibility of a Chapter 9 bankruptcy liquidating ALL the city owned art ( which is ALL OF IT ) are not even being discussed and instead are replaced with character assassinations, which distract from the topic at hand. This is, in fact, a minimum of $230,000,000.00 over ten years, and possibly much. much more if assessments increase during that period. Yet there is NO accountability, the language is intentionally ambiguous, the operating agreement expires in the middle of the 10 year term - NONE OF THIS is addressed in the ballot language. The DIA is not even specifically named so we don't know WHERE the money will really go. Are YOU convinced all involved will "do the right thing" ? I'm certainly not.

Millagers are all over Tietz & Co. here for not inviting DIAniks to this Pro-Liberty forum in Troy. Does anyone think these same millagers will be the least bothered if DIAniks don't invite Pro-Liberty speakers that DIA Pro-Tax rally Tuesday in Detroit?

Here is an excellent list of reasons to NOT support the millage increase, published by the Bloomfield-Bloomfield Hills Patch:

http://bloomfield-mi.patch.com/articles/opinion-15-reasons-to-vote-against-the-dia-millage#comments_list

Here is a great fact based post in the Bloomfield Patch about why we should vote no for this tax increase. Plenty to learn about this issue, do not believe the marketing words given in the TV commercials, facts seem to always get in the way of the spin masters.

http://bloomfield-mi.patch.com/articles/opinion-15-reasons-to-vote-against-the-dia-millage#comment_4144596

http://troyareateaparty.org/special-events/
All this from the Tea Party group who sponsored the event Dr. Barr attended.
Fair and balance??????

Twenty dollars is a brick in the wall against family even given free admission all year? Does that mean that taking the kids to the movies is also detrimental to the family, becausse it might cost more than $20. Going to an art museum all year for free would seem to be very good for families, children, and our civilization. It is a good deal, if people take advantage of it.

It's just that we can't believe any of these panelists. Why bother with their arguments when they are all cheats and scoundrels? Tietz called the scandal rag he ran in 2008 the "Michigan Civil Rights Initiative" to TRICK people into signing the petition and voting for it. Why do they always cheat? Why, if you are correct, do you have to lie and cheat, like Bob Gosselin and the three fake library proposals in 2010 and Glenn Clark claiming an opponent was pro-public-gay-sex?? These people on this panel don't know how to tell the truth, so when they say to do something, I just do the opposite. And if you don't think it is relevant to speak of the character of these politicians, you are wrong!

It is very bad for Troy , Oakland county, state of michigan that voters do not research all candidates before voting for them. Today most candidates for office have a record and it can be easily found on the internet . As matter of practice I never listen or act on campagin literature or ads . I look for records of past activity in policy opinions . I do vote for my own best interest but not at the sake of what seems like the best interest for the city, county,state, and nation . I never vote for people who say "no new taxes "or use "never" in statements . The reason is that logic tells me that they will not be problem solvers but idealogues.
Bob Gosselin makes peopl like Tietz is idealogue . I want overheard a council person say " we delay votes on some issues so we can get Bob's opinion . after hearing that I watched and guess what there was a pattern of delays on some issues and reason for those delays were silly . If people had watched Mayor Daniels
just once in public comment over the years most who did would not have voted for her. Troy voters have a habit of not doing due diligence before failing to vote or voting in city elections . Whats more many Troy voters also sound unimformed when talking about city issues , yet the city works hard and always have on informing citizens on happenings . hoping they learn but it happens over and over .

Lucille this WAS not a candidates forum - it was about a TAX INCREASE. I hope you apply your own logic to researching this issue - because if you do I am certain you will come to the same conclusion we have.

After the successful pleadings before a Wayne County Probate court judge, the DIA have successfully (and quietly) obtained re-allocation of trust distributions from the Tannahill Trust and Kanzler Foundation Endowment for the Arts. Wayne County Probate Court has allowed the DIA to use these funds for operations, instead of art purchases, for the next five years.

But its all about increasing the ENDOWMENTS? They had to "convince" these trust administrators to go along with this diversion of funds from what those benefactors intended. WHY??

A TALE OF TWO ART MUSEUMS

While the DIA falsely attempts to mislead voters by presenting itself as a draw for economic growth in our area, the sun shines bright in nearby Toledo, Ohio- home to the Toledo Museum of Art (TMA). Despite the close proximity to the DIA, the world-renowned TMA does not appear to be plagued by the threat of imminent closure in the absence of public or taxpayer funding.

The Toledo Museum of Art, founded in 1901, spans 6 buildings on a 36 acre campus. The TMA remains a privately-endowed, non-profit institution and opens its collection to the public, free of charge, six days a week (309 days a year).

Despite being in a smaller market and having another major art museum in Cleveland, the TMA has reported assets of $273 million compared to $194 million for the DIA. Conversely, the TMA was able to operate its sprawling campus on $14.1 million in FY2011, while the DIA spent almost twice as much at $27.6 million. With its larger asset pool and lower operating cost, the TMA is able to fund its operation through investment income and annual fundraising while simultaneously providing free admission to all. We hope the DIA will look into emulating this model of self-sustainability rather than forcing an additional burden on weary property owners.

Using Cleveland here is a huge red herring. It is 2 hours away from Toledo. The DIA is MUCH closer to Toledo. And the collection the DIA has is not comparable to Toledo in any way. Comparing metro areas served between Detroit and Toledo is an even bigger joke.

This is also something I find wrong with it. The amount coming from each county. All of these numbers are provided by the DIA.

The millage expected to be raised from each county...
Oakland $10 million
Wayne $8 million
Macomb $5 million

Now, the museum averages 400,000 per year.
32% from Wayne
19% from Oakland
10% from Macomb

19% of the visitors are from Oakland, but funding of 43% of the $23 Million.

Oakland county - Vote NO.