Copycat? Recall Janice Daniels Group Seeing Red Over No Troy Recall Signs
Some say new signs from No Troy Recall bear a striking resemblance to signs from Recall Janice Daniels – what do you think?
Photos
In March, political action committee Recall Janice Daniels printed its new logo for the first time, attaching it as a bumper sticker to clipboards that would be used to collect the nearly 9,000 signatures needed to trigger a recall election on Nov. 6 for Troy Mayor Janice Daniels, who first came under fire in December for using a gay slur on her personal Facebook page.
This month, No Troy Recall – a political action committee recently formed in support of the mayor – had signs printed that some say bear a striking resemblance to the logo and signs used by Recall Janice Daniels.
“We first noticed the signs on the 24th," said John Kulesz, co-founder of Recall Janice Daniels, on Thursday. "We got a phone call from a supporter.”
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Kulesz said the signs are quite similar in font, color scheme, and even the large red exclamation point.
"It’s unfortunate that Mayor Daniels has chosen to copy the hard work of the recall volunteers," Kulesz said. "Clearly she’s opted for a campaign of deception. A true leader wouldn’t attempt to deceive the voters.”
But Ray Watts, treasurer for No Troy Recall, said he does not believe the signs look that similar, pointing out that the Recall Janice Daniels signs have black lettering while their signs do not.
“There was no intent to be similar at all," Watts said. "It’s pretty much coincidence."
Watts said he didn't recall doing any work on the signs himself and that the signs were designed by Pontiac-based Done Right Enterprises.
"The name No Troy Recall was sent to the sign company, and quite frankly, they designed the sign in about four versions," Watts said. "Three or four versions came to us, and we decided which one to use."
Done Right Enterprises co-owner Kevin Ollila, however, said they rarely design logos for their customers, and No Troy Recall was not an exception.
"We’re a printer," Ollila said. "We’re a screen printer. We take what’s submitted and create the sign.”
He said that the company's artist will sometimes work with a client to create a design, but in this case, "there was nothing changed."
"Nothing happened differently than what would normally happen," Ollila said. "In that case, we go by the direct guidance of our client. We don’t just make up signs.”
Watts maintains any design similarities between their signs and the Recall Janice Daniels signs are just a coincidence. "Even if it were similar in their opinion, I don’t know if there’s a law against it," he said.
"It’s disappointing," Kulesz said. "If Mayor Daniels were to display true leadership, she would make it about what she’s done in office. She doesn’t want to. She wants to make it on anything but a referendum on her leadership.”
Do you think the signs are similar? Why or why not? Tell us in the comments below!
cookiepro2
7:48 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
They are similar and I think it is intentional, but I don't see how that would change anyone's vote. To me, both signs will serve to remind people about the issue...they'll see Recall and the big exclamtion mark and remember that it is on the ballot, and hopefully turnover their ballot and vote their choice. Frankly, I can't wait for November to come and have this matter done with.
Barbara Koehn
8:44 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
Just another example of Janice in action. Will it confuse the general public? probably not-People who want to vote yes WILL-Perhaps as Cookiepro2 said "it will serve to remind people about the issue" I think people have had enough of the bad publicity, the ineptitude and the total lack of professionalism the mayor has brought to the City of Troy. When November 6 comes around, let's just hope that people make the correct decision-Recall Janice Daniels!!!
Rita Cartier
8:47 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
It's the Tea Party ~ What do you expect?
Sue Martin
8:48 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
Wait, wait, wait...Mayor Daniels's close friend, treasurer and finance guy on the PAC is directly contradicted by the printer (whom we have to assume has no political motivation)? This is the kind of person with which she surrounds herself? One who would so blatantly spin a tale of deceit?
Vote YES to Recall Janice Daniels in November...your vote is a YES vote for integrity to return to Troy.
Wiley Coyote
9:37 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
Ray Watts is a liar. What a shock. He's a friend of Janice's.
Hey Ray, bet your kids are proud of you.
And Janice paid for it. The single worst thing she can do is put up more reminders of the recall. So thanks, Ms. Daniels. Only thing you've done right yet.
My god, the gall of these people. "No intent to be similar." Wow. If the general public wasn't aware of the flat-out deceit of Janice and her supporters, they will be now.
Sharon
9:38 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
The problem is, this is not the first time... http://www.keeptroystrong.com/2012/09/on-imitation-and-flattery.html
Dale Murrish
9:53 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
Ah yes, the political season sprouts signs and yet more complaints. I especially like how many yards have Yes Recall signs and Kerwin signs and Schilling signs, showing the "non-partisan" leanings of many recall supporters.
But my favorite is one yard with FOUR Yes! Recall signs. Can't wait for November 7. Or January 1 if the recall is successful.
Jeff S.
10:01 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
What happens on January 1?
Lynn Hodorek
10:57 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
Dale, I'd be interested in hearing more about the yard with four signs. Does it sit on a corner lot at the intersection of two busy streets? Or is it in a subdivision? My instinct tells me that your statement may be slightly hyperbolic, but if there is a house that is overdoing it with yard signs maybe it should be looked into.
Cathy Fucinari
9:34 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
Being a sign enforcement volunteer with the city, I can speak to this with actual knowledge. Any yard can have up to 14 sq ft of signs, there is no limit on how many that is. The only limitation is that they cannot be on public property and they must be there with the permission of the owner. I have Kerwin and Schilling, in addition to the recall effort. Big surprise,. Let's just say that Kerwin's opponent is a master at misrepresenting the facts, and Schilling's opponent is less straightforward than Eddie Haskel.
And Dale, I know you have been informed by the Patch, by readers in the comments, and by SEVERAL other sources, that as soon as the votes are certified, Janice will be recalled and be out of office immediately. What does Nov 7 or Jan 1 have to do with the recall?
Lynn Hodorek
10:10 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
Thanks for clarifying the signage limitations Cathy! Useful knowledge, for sure.
canseeallsides
12:27 am on Monday, October 1, 2012
Being a constitutionalist, I may have knowledge to share. The higher courts have determined a city CANNOT repeat CANNOT make separate "content" signage legal codes. Which means they CANNOT have "retail" sign codes or any sign codes that differ from one another.
Look up, "yard signs are free speech" or "cannot restrict one type of signage" or "A sign ordinance cannot regulate the content of signs."
So to know the only sign limit, simply find the code that allows the largest sign and that should be the ONLY enforceable code, it would apply to all signage.
All that being the constitutional truth, I think signs look horrible on our landscape. I wish the majority used voting records and view points instead of ads and fads. (Obviously, do not take this as any sort of legal advice as the legal game is rigged and you will pay even if you "win." Just look up the info and stay informed.)yard signs are free speech
CC
9:53 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
I agree with cookiepro2...I think this was a dumb decision by Daniels from a strategic point of view...and an even worse decision from an ethical point of view. It just serves as another reminder at the dirty politics that Janice loves to play.
Exactly right, Sue. Copying the sign is lame and is intended to deceive...but the comments in the article where Watts blatantly lies tells me all I need to know. Thankfully the Patch didn't just take Watt's word for it and followed up with the printer company. This is what Janice's group has been doing for years and now they are finally being exposed for the liars they are. This a great city and it deserves so much better.
Janice - your tricks are getting old and they aren't working anymore. See you in November.
Toby Gosselin
11:19 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
Enough !! Copying the signs are intentional;made to trick voters and infringe on the voice of the people.Mayor Daniels has proven she is not to be trusted over and over again.....shameful.
Vote "YES," Recall Mayor Janice Daniels...your chance to make a positive change for Troy-2012.
Catherine Cooper Bauer
11:25 pm on Thursday, September 27, 2012
vote YES to recall Janice Daniels... this is more of her deceptive ways just trying to confuse .... I think it is a backfire though ....remember YES to RECALL!
Really
7:51 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
Ray Watts, "There was no intent to be similar at all, ....sent to the sign company. ...they designed the sign. We decided which one to use." Done Right Enterprises, "We take what’s submitted... We don’t just make up signs." How can anyone trust any of these people. And Dale, once again, you completely ignore the reall issue here, lying and obsfucation.
Glenn
8:18 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
I love how Ray Watts is totally incompetent. He gets caught in a blatant lie in this article. He files the Statement of Organization for No Troy Recall on 8-28-12, but forgets and puts Janice Daniels address down under "sponsors name." Somebody informs him that he shouldn't have done this because it's a direct link to Daniels, so he goes back on 9-19-12 and submits an amended Statement of Organization with his own address in place of Daniels. Probably without knowing that the original document is a matter of public record. Talk about Keystone Cops. After everything she's done to herself so far, If this is the type of genius she continues to surround herself with, heaven help us all if she isn't recalled. http://courts.oakgov.com/cfrs/iDocuments.php?iCommitteeID=11820&cmdOk=View+Campaign+Statements
Debbie Sosa
8:43 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
Recall Janice Daniels? Seems to me that the majority of residents in Troy were fed up with the politicians that were running our city into the ground. If we recall her, you want the same people to take over the city, again? Over my dead body!!!!
I would like her to have one term to prove she can make improvements. Just seems like those that support the previous administration are hell bent on getting her out of office as soon as possible, because she is doing the things she promised us, some of which are saving the city's money!
I respect her for stepping up as Mayor, and for taking a thankless job, for barely any pay, and having to listen to all the cry baby's demean her on a daily basis. She is not in this for the money, power or notoriety. She became Mayor because she wanted a change, just like the majority of Troy residents.
Whatever happens to her term, I will always respect her and I hope we don't return to the misled ways of the past!!!
Jeff S.
9:03 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
How has she accomplished "saving the city's money"? Can you give me one example?
Sue Martin
9:07 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
Jeff beat me to it! I was going to point out that in fact...Janice advocated for depleting our fund balance to cover increasing refuse and sewage charges. You know, that fund balance that would be GONE anyway in five years if revenues weren't increased and/or further cuts to infrastructure made. She must have figured we didn't need to wait five years to go bankrupt.
Glenn
9:12 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
Oh my!! Debbie's going to lay down her life for Janice. Hyperbole anyone? Just curious Debbie, Daniels has been in office a year and sat silent during the budget meetings. She still doesn't understand how to run council meetings. The only "improvement" that she could possibly claim was her doing was increasing the amount of time that citizens could speak at council meetings and that has now been rescinded because it backfired on her . What is holding her back from making improvements so far besides utter incompetence? A majority of Troy residents may have wanted change, but it will be obvious in November that they didn't want Daniels. By the way, maybe you haven't noticed, but nobody's trying to recall Henderson, Tietz or Fleming who are just as politically conservative as Daniels so simply being on the wrong side of the political fence doesn't seem to trigger a recall around here. Apparently, you have to be a complete failure to qualify for that honor. See you at the polls Deb!!
Ellen Hodorek
9:41 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
Debbie: Janice Daniels has been part of the problem all along. The subversive efforts of a the council minority with Janice Daniels as their spokesperson was what sent the city into the negative trajectory in the first place. Honestly. Had the direction of council majority and city administration been followed in the first place, Troy would be in a much better position today. The path we're on is one carved out by Janice Daniels, Martin Howrylak, Wade Fleming, etc. Honestly. Had we taken the other path your property taxes would have still gone down, cuts still would have been made at City Hall and we would not have this rancor. It's so sad. But, honestly. Go back and watch what has unfolded.
Linda
1:57 pm on Friday, September 28, 2012
Janice became Mayor for many reasons. I feel she wanted the power, notoriety and the opportunity to cram her ideologies down the throats of the citizens. She has done enough damage in less than year. Why would anyone want to continue the smearing of our City's reputation and the onslaught of more inept behavior?
Irv Wengrow
9:39 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
The signage controversy is good since it just brings more attention to the basic issue - who she is and why the recall effort is underway
Cathy Fucinari
9:45 am on Friday, September 28, 2012
Excuse me Debbie Sosa! Members of the previous administration are running for positions that have NOTHING to do with city government. Janice did not want the Mayor's job because she cares about the city. She wants power. This was a stepping stone for her. Remember the tape that identified her as the "Queen" of the Tea Party? Interesting choice of words - infers royalty. That's a real patriot for ya! I remember when Janice stood at the podium screaming at the previous administration, who by the way made the same money she is making now. I remember her lies and manipulations. Don't forget the shirt with Vote NO on the back in duct tape. Really. Perhaps now she'll make herself a crown with Vote No in duct tape and wear it to council meetings.
She has exposed her incompetence and arrogance. Better pre-pay those funeral arrangements, Debbie. Her removal is coming.
Dale Murrish
12:08 pm on Friday, September 28, 2012
November 7 is the day after the election, when there will be peace in Troy if the recall is unsuccessful (at least stunned silence for a few weeks until the mayor's opponents regroup).
January 1 will be more peaceful if the mayor is recalled. The council will have figured out how to choose the city spokesman and the tie-breaking council member. Other than that, city business at the council meetings will grind to a halt for a few months in November and December.
The house with four signs is on Wattles Road, not a corner lot. I'll check next time I drive by to see if it's one house or two next door to each other. Maybe Cathy could help police that since she knows the rules so well. I don't really care - it's just eye pollution for everyone when done to excess.
Glenn
12:12 pm on Friday, September 28, 2012
Dale: "I don't really care - it's just eye pollution for everyone when done to excess."
Just like Dale's articles and comments!
Sue Martin
2:12 pm on Friday, September 28, 2012
Dale, how will city business grind to a halt? Are you saying that the remaining council members will be unable to function with the loss of Mayor Daniels at the helm? If so, how is it you have such a low opinion of their ability to perform their duties?
CC
3:48 pm on Friday, September 28, 2012
Dale - not sure about city business grinding to a halt. I will remind you that the other 6 council members were able to successfully work together and agree on a budget. the lone dissenting vote came from the least engaged in the process...and she'll be gone in November.
Sandra L. Jestic
4:49 pm on Friday, September 28, 2012
I feel these signs should stop!! There are alot of houses for sale in our city this is not making new people looking at houses feeling like this is the "City of Tomorrow". I lived here since 1957. We do not need negativity for our city. I don't feel what Ms. Daniels said and has done has marred this city. All of you should take all that negative energy and money spent on these signs and apply to more positive for the city. These signs are really making my neighborhood trashy looking. Please!!!
Cathy Fucinari
8:17 am on Saturday, September 29, 2012
Political signs appear during every election season. Did you forget? I've seen them every year actually! Every 4 years for President, every 2 years for congress, and in between for state and city. It is an ongoing process. I would never describe the democratic process as a waste of money or "trashy" looking.
BTW, the negativity that was brought by Janice and her posse is what has marred this city. She pointed the finger and made allegations of dishonesty. Yet, when she had the opportunity to amend the city budget, she didn't open her mouth. Gee, I wonder if she was telling the truth before she was elected? Is she capable of comprehending how governmental unit budgeting operates? I think not in both cases.
Greg Wujek
9:12 pm on Friday, September 28, 2012
Ms. Jestic, I'm sorry the signs are upsetting you. But as a young person who planned to return to Troy after finishing my MBA, I can tell you that what Daniels has done has most definitely marred this city. She has made Troy a joke. I was embarrassed to say where I was from until the Recall effort came about. If you're worried about selling your home, the Recall signs are the least of your worries. If I were you, I'd get one and put it up. One month of signs is nothing compared to another 3 years of diarreah of the mouth she is sure to fling. Her words hit my generation as verbal, bigoted and ignorant trash. If she had resigned as she should have this would not be happening. Since she didn't resign, she is the one bringing this on. It has to happen. I came home for a visit this weekend, and was excited to see so many "yes" signs out. Check out their web site: recalljanicedaniels.com.
Lynn Hodorek
10:30 pm on Friday, September 28, 2012
YES. Yes to everything Greg said. Couldn't have said it better myself.
Sandra L. Jestic
9:11 am on Saturday, September 29, 2012
I really don't think you can compare presidential signs to your signs. Yours are very negative. We are not representing ourselves as a positive, happy place to live. Now your opposing team are going to put up even more ugly signs. I am not going head to head with you about Ms. Daniels. I have lived in Troy for over 50 years and have seen good mayors and bad mayors. Good things and bad things. I am excited the roads are finally getting some repair. Kudos who ever was responsible for that. Now if we can fill all the empty buildings in the city that would be great. just saying!!!!
Cathy Fucinari
9:40 am on Saturday, September 29, 2012
Vote yes is a negative? I've lived here for 36 years. The atmosphere fostered by Janice and her buddies is 180 degrees from the community I chose to build in and live in for 36 years raising my family. How do you figure "your opposing team" is mine? I have seen bad elected officials in the past, but not one that is as opening bigoted and incompetent, with an ideological agenda as hateful as hers. I don't think sitting back and saying nothing, just letting it happen, is the right approach. The community as a whole has stepped up to stop it.. What "side" is that? I'd say it is the "side" of our community, and we're taking it back.
Sandra L. Jestic
9:44 am on Saturday, September 29, 2012
You are mssing my point. end of conversation!!!!! To much negativity for me.
Chris P.
11:18 am on Saturday, September 29, 2012
I love the signs! As a business woman here who works to fill commercial property be assured that those signs are well received and are creating a great deal of optimism!!!!! When you understand the facts and know how her behavior is being received by business leaders, you understand that this is a very positive time for Troy.
Toby Gosselin
8:43 am on Sunday, September 30, 2012
Greg/Chris P: Thank you for your voices. Welcome back to Troy! Home buyers are now seeking areas where VOTE: YES...RECALL JANICE DANIELS signs are located. Smart homeowners see the value of the YES:RECALL as an investment in their community. Kudos to the RECALL TEAM, VOTE "YES": RECALL Nov. 6th
Glen Hilzinger
1:38 pm on Sunday, September 30, 2012
"It’s pretty much coincidence." Really? That just goes to show how stupid Janice and her supporters think we all are. Their lies and deception got our beautiful city into this ugly situation in the first place. But in this case I think it will backfire. That would truly be poetic justice.
Barbara Koehn
8:40 pm on Sunday, September 30, 2012
As a homeowner, I have 2 Yes to the RECALL behind my fence on Wattles-AND 1 on on my front lawn, along with a Kerwin sign and a Meisner sign!! I am pleased to be able to support those whom I feel will benefit my family! I can't wait until all the politics and the election ends-Not because of the negativity, but because perhaps our city will be able to finally get back down to business-Janice Daniels has got to go, none of this recall campaign would have had to happen if she had just resigned. Because she made her choice, tsome citizens of Troy had to act on behalf of the city-Enough is enough-Recall Janice Daniels, November 6!!
Cathy Fucinari
8:40 am on Monday, October 1, 2012
Amen, Barbara. I've been fighting for Troy for more than 4 years. We. as a nation and as a community, need to remember that when we stop scrutinizing , the vermin come out of the woodwork. We all need to be aware of what is going on all of the time, not just in times of crises.
Concerned and Informed
11:51 am on Thursday, October 4, 2012
As an observer of this debate, all I can see is that the opponents of Mayor Daniels are a bunch of small minded people with too much time on their hands...imagine arguing over the design of signs during this serious economic crisis....
Glenn
12:27 pm on Thursday, October 4, 2012
Concerned and Informed: Based on your post, I can only conclude that since you had the time to weigh in with your opinion on this matter that you must be a fellow opponent of Mayor Daniels. Why you would refer to yourself as small minded is a little puzzling, but I guess some people just have low self-esteem. Glad to have you on the Vote Yes to Recall Mayor Daniels train. :-)
tlc
12:17 pm on Thursday, October 4, 2012
Is it possible that the point is not just the deception of the signs but the continual acts of deception. Deceiving letters, editorial comments that have falsehoods, several different but similar proposals for the Library ballot, not to mention 13 additional nonsense recall petitions ( a real waste of taxpayer dollars A& a Daniels supporter), let's just look closely at the article - I believe either Mr. Watts (w/Daniels Campaign) or the printer must not be telling the truth. Deception - this is what I see in this string - not just signs. We have been living the economic crisis and the Mayor has been not able to give any possitive or workable suggestions - she voted No on the budget yet offered no possible ways to change. Deception - except she can say for sure - she didn't vote to the budget ot transit but offered no viable options. She is also proud that she got the Library open on Saturday but also voted No to open the Library on Saturday. Truth or Deception? Not just a discussion on signs
Lynn Hodorek
4:10 pm on Thursday, October 4, 2012
Obviously Mr. Watts is the one who lied to the reporter. What would the printing company have to gain by lying about it? Watts is trying to cover his butt. Typical of someone associated with this failure of a mayor. Your point is right: this is a pattern of deception. It's NOT just about these signs...it goes back to the very beginning of Daniels' foray into the public arena.
Rebecca
4:40 pm on Saturday, October 6, 2012
What a bunch of petty people. She was elected to balance the budget, not get us into more debt. So the only lame argument is a sign and a slur. I would say that she has very few skeletons in her closet. Leave her alone and stop trying to divide the community like our president is trying to divide the country.
Daffy Noodnicks
4:51 pm on Saturday, October 6, 2012
Well, Rebecca sorry to throw a little reality into things, but the budget has always been balanced and she has done absolutely nothing to impact out budget in any way at all.
And it wasn't just A slur. It has been slur after slur and they keep coming. And there are numerous other reasons for the recall. Check the recall website or petition if you are interested in the facts.
SHE is dividing the community. That is why she needs to be recalled.
Daffy Noodnicks
4:57 pm on Saturday, October 6, 2012
And by the way, what world do you live in where slurring people is ok? One is not ok in my book (about ANYONE). Slur after slur is just plain horrible.
Rebecca
7:34 pm on Tuesday, October 9, 2012
So you have never said the wrong thing to the wrong person? You've never offended someone? Does it make you a bad person if you've stuck your foot in your mouth? Wow. You should run for president since you have NEVER said anything that you regret. Wish we could all be perfect like you.
Glenn
7:55 pm on Tuesday, October 9, 2012
That's kind of the point of all this Rebecca. Daniels doesn't regret it. She keeps repeating offensive comments that the Mayor of Troy doesn't have any business addressing in the first place. Everybody has said things they regret. Her problem is she not only says things that she should regret and doesn't, but she keeps doubling down on them.
Daffy Noodnicks
9:32 pm on Tuesday, October 9, 2012
Well, Rebecca, if I say the wrong to someone that is unnnecessarily offensive to them I apologize and don't repeat it (over and over), and if I stick my foot in my mouth I endeavor not to do it again. I feel that is what a self-aware adult should do.
The mayor has done none of these things. In fact she completely stands by her offensive false statements, repeats them on the radio, and mails them to my house.
Jeff
7:55 pm on Saturday, October 6, 2012
Janice Daniels and her cronies (i.e. Mr. Watts etc.) always live by the philosophy... "the end justifies the means."
What puzzles me is how can Janice Daniels, in good conscious, claim to be a devout Christian then turn around and spread lies, deceit, and harmful speech towards others?
Sorry Janice, nice try. You simply can't have it both ways...
I can't wait to VOTE YES - RECALL JANICE DANIELS on Nov. 6
Concerned Citizen
12:26 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
22 This righteousness is given through faith in[h] Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference between Jew and Gentile, 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus
Glenn
12:45 pm on Sunday, October 14, 2012
If Jesus wants to forgive her that's his business. I'm voting Yes to Recall Janice Daniels.